Beryl Yes, it certainly seems so.

Velma Yes, it does.

John Well, yes.

Velma There’s just very little accountability and the lines are always blurred.

Beryl There seems to be a culture of ‘genius artists’ who are/have been untouchable because their process is their process.

Peter Do you mean more than in other sections of the profession?

Jon Peter – that’s an interesting question.

Peter Most complaints seem to come from those doing screen work.

Velma Complaints are a sign of things working though, in terms of having somewhere or someone to report to safely.

Dicky I think safeguarding is better than it used to be, simply because we are talking about it now.

John Theatre seems to make quite a big noise about safeguarding, while simultaneously trying to cover it up.

Peter I suspect that in theatre we talk to each other more – so fewer suffer in silence.

Velma It’s a power issue.

Beryl When folk have smoke blown up their arses, they become empowered to act on their status. I feel as though it is deeply cultural, connected to elitism, power and the ‘specialness’ of our industry.

Velma But I think theatre promotes this ‘we’re all friends, this is just friendly’ attitude in a way that screen doesn’t as much.

Dicky People will always have a problem telling the truth to people in power.

Jon And even when they do, the worry is that it’s not responded to appropriately. Imagine reporting rehearsal room abuse, with all the fear and courage that takes, and then nothing happening.

Peter The power structures in screen work are more complex than in theatre.

Jon True. But there are also just more people on a TV or film set than in a rehearsal room, so dodgy practices are harder to do out in the open – or at least harder to cover up. In screen work, the problem usually seems to be the talent doing what they want, even if that’s abusive. What’s worrying in theatre is the idea that abusive behaviour is being packaged as part of the job.

John Theatres seem to be using intimacy directors more often, which is very good.

Dicky Drama schools are the worst for it. So many times we were told: “That’s just how it is in the profession.”

John I increasingly feel as if drama schools are actually terrible in preparing you for the profession.

Beryl The want – the hunger – to succeed can breed a very unhealthy lack of boundaries – the need to go the ‘extra mile’.

Velma It’s so exploitative. I’ve known of people being encouraged – in a group scenario at drama school – to abuse and humiliate another student.

Jon A young actor I know came to me about being asked at drama school how far he would be prepared to go sexually to get a job. He was very distressed and confused about the conversation and I had to explain that this type of behaviour has no place in training.

Peter It’s a very inappropriate question for anyone at a drama school to ask.

Beryl I was told recently about a very well-known director who started his rehearsal period by saying: “Okay, I don’t want anyone coming to me and saying that they take offence to stuff.”

Jon I would so have wanted to say: “Well, I take offence at that.”

John So what we have deduced is that this is a problem at the very bottom and top of the profession.

Jon Don’t forget the middle, John. So, what do we do? The people behind the reporting of all the Chris Goode abuse seem to come from a real desire to enact change.

Maybe until an organisation can prove that it has appropriate safeguarding in place, it doesn’t get funding

John Surely this has to begin with funding? Maybe until an organisation can prove that it has appropriate safeguarding in place, it doesn’t get the cash. It doesn’t solve the issue, but it’s a start.

Jon I guess it’s true that organisations will only do something if the bottom line is threatened.

John After the allegations against Kevin Spacey, the Old Vic introduced Old Vic Guardians. Do we know if that has made a difference?

Jon I understand the frustration with official inaction – some of the people alleged to have turned a blind eye to Spacey all still have very good jobs – but it’s worrying when there are no checks and balances.

Velma I think that there’s a problem with the ‘line’ – as in, if someone wasn’t Me Too’d, then they might feel they are on the right side of the line. And that stops people from reflecting on or changing their behaviour – unless they’re caught.

Beryl Exactly that!